When you gave a talk for FAIR, it appeared to me that you implied that it was beneficial for those who were AGP to medically transition. In particular, you introduced two young people who had done so. You often allude to people in the past having had better outcomes. My understanding is that outcome studies were flawed in the past and re…
When you gave a talk for FAIR, it appeared to me that you implied that it was beneficial for those who were AGP to medically transition. In particular, you introduced two young people who had done so. You often allude to people in the past having had better outcomes. My understanding is that outcome studies were flawed in the past and remain flawed now. One doesn't know how those people were doing in general.
The Gijs and Brewaeys 2007 review found:
"In addition to the design problems of the studies, patient numbers are seriously skewed. A large number of patients who received surgery were lost at follow-up (see Table 1): For the FMs the attrition rate varies between 0% and 81%, with an average of 24% (based on Boldund & Kullgren, 1996; Eldh et al., 1997; Hepp et al., 2002; Lobato et al., 2006; Raufleish et al., 1998; Smith et al., 2005a, Tsoi et al., 1995). For the MFs, between 0% and 73% did not participate in the follow-up, with an average attrition rate of 39%..."
They say it is an effective treatment quoting a study with 1 year followup, but then say why you can't trust the studies they quote! (Their reasons are good.)
Even the 2014 Swedish regret study, which checked for regret by looking for a name change, appears to have undercounted. They found a median time to regret of about 8 years, but their study of 681 people included 360 who had first applied to the program between 2001 and 2010, which is a 3 year process with surgery at the end. But these people from 2001-2010 do not seem to have been followed-up 8 years. So dropping that last group as not having median regret time (table 4), the name change rate is 4.4% . And then there is the fact that about 6-8% died (with a suicide rate of 19x the general population). So even their small regret number is suspect.
And there are those who say they can't reverse the changes and it is too exhausting to try again and give up, who certainly aren't your positive outcomes, but I don't think anyone is counting them. The reason the Dutch went to younger people was in part because many adults were having poor outcomes.
You have your anecdotes of good outcomes, I'm sure.
Are you claiming that any boys who are aroused to any extent at any time by thinking of themselves as women means they are AGP and should medically transition? Would be likely to benefit from it?
The Swedish death study (Cecilia Dhejne, Karolinska Inst. 2011) found the death by suicide in post op natal females who identified as "trans men" was actually 40 TIMES HIGHER than the rate of death by suicide of the age matched control group Swedes. This was so shocking that they combined the natal males and natal females in the post op category to come up with 19X higher. There were more males so the math hid the terrible results for females. Not sure if this is the same study. My understanding is the famed "Dutch study" (DeVries, Steensma, et al, 2014) assumed that treatment at a younger age would result in greater happiness, as they theorized that the examples of transitioned adults' dissatisfaction had to do with "not passing."
When you gave a talk for FAIR, it appeared to me that you implied that it was beneficial for those who were AGP to medically transition. In particular, you introduced two young people who had done so. You often allude to people in the past having had better outcomes. My understanding is that outcome studies were flawed in the past and remain flawed now. One doesn't know how those people were doing in general.
The Gijs and Brewaeys 2007 review found:
"In addition to the design problems of the studies, patient numbers are seriously skewed. A large number of patients who received surgery were lost at follow-up (see Table 1): For the FMs the attrition rate varies between 0% and 81%, with an average of 24% (based on Boldund & Kullgren, 1996; Eldh et al., 1997; Hepp et al., 2002; Lobato et al., 2006; Raufleish et al., 1998; Smith et al., 2005a, Tsoi et al., 1995). For the MFs, between 0% and 73% did not participate in the follow-up, with an average attrition rate of 39%..."
They say it is an effective treatment quoting a study with 1 year followup, but then say why you can't trust the studies they quote! (Their reasons are good.)
Even the 2014 Swedish regret study, which checked for regret by looking for a name change, appears to have undercounted. They found a median time to regret of about 8 years, but their study of 681 people included 360 who had first applied to the program between 2001 and 2010, which is a 3 year process with surgery at the end. But these people from 2001-2010 do not seem to have been followed-up 8 years. So dropping that last group as not having median regret time (table 4), the name change rate is 4.4% . And then there is the fact that about 6-8% died (with a suicide rate of 19x the general population). So even their small regret number is suspect.
And there are those who say they can't reverse the changes and it is too exhausting to try again and give up, who certainly aren't your positive outcomes, but I don't think anyone is counting them. The reason the Dutch went to younger people was in part because many adults were having poor outcomes.
You have your anecdotes of good outcomes, I'm sure.
Are you claiming that any boys who are aroused to any extent at any time by thinking of themselves as women means they are AGP and should medically transition? Would be likely to benefit from it?
The Swedish death study (Cecilia Dhejne, Karolinska Inst. 2011) found the death by suicide in post op natal females who identified as "trans men" was actually 40 TIMES HIGHER than the rate of death by suicide of the age matched control group Swedes. This was so shocking that they combined the natal males and natal females in the post op category to come up with 19X higher. There were more males so the math hid the terrible results for females. Not sure if this is the same study. My understanding is the famed "Dutch study" (DeVries, Steensma, et al, 2014) assumed that treatment at a younger age would result in greater happiness, as they theorized that the examples of transitioned adults' dissatisfaction had to do with "not passing."
Wow.
Even if they don't regret it, it does not make transition less damaging to their fertility. It is common for delusions to never to go away.