Another example is the area of addiction recovery. Rehabs funded with federal dollars proudly tout their sweat lodges, talking circles, and sage burning for native clients. But try, as a therapist, to remind a deeply Christian grandma about a Bible verse pertaining to her grief counseling---not with federal dollars!!! One issue here is the definition of religion. See historian Tom Holland about how this word is uniquely Western.
One discipline in cultural anthropology is the study of human activities and belief systems that fall under the category of religion. This is not an attempt to determine whether there is a correct religion. Rather, it seeks to understand human behavior that can be categorized as religious across many cultures. It includes the belief in unseen supernatural forces and adherence to to strictly enforced taboos. Consistent with human nature there is usually a hierarchy of "clergy" who acquire considerable power and authority which they exert on members of their culture. It seems like it is human nature for individuals to embrace these belief systems and follow such religious edicts. In current western cultures many people exhibit religious behavior while condemning formal religion. An example is the fervor that some people display when they consider the issue of climate change. I've had lengthy interactions with some of them and can only characterize them as religious zealots.
Japan, the Soviet Union, China, India and the US have now all landed a spacecraft on the moon. I think giving consideration to each nations various religion concerns and objection is not as important as making sure the moon is not "claimed" by any one of them, divided up or fought after.
This seems very sensible. We do not want to export ownership ideas from Earth to space. The moon, if it is to be "colonized", should be done in a international perspective.
"NOPE" says you. So what? You're an ideologue, face up to it. You're also living in a dream world. Raised on Star Trek philosophy, no doubt. I always wondered, as I pursued my own studies in science, Why is it that humans can't be bothered to deal with the mess they've made of their own planet, they want to take their mess to other planets? Have fun living on the Moon, genius.
It's not going to be regular folks like you who'll have the 'freedom' to live on the moon. Do you know what conditions there are like? Imagine the cost. Nope, only the trillionaires and their slaves will ever go near the moon.
-> Quote: Article II of the treaty explicitly forbids any government from claiming a celestial body such as the Moon or a planet as its own territory, whether by declaration, occupation, or "any other means".
You can also see this religious preference for indigenous beliefs in play in the bizarre battle over construction of the thirty meter telescope on Mauna Kea in Hawaii. One of the primary objections made by activists (really just a handful of academics with dubious credentials) was that the mountain was 'sacred' to native Hawaiians and the construction would prevent loosely defined 'native cultural practices'. Both federal and state governments took this nonsense seriously and construction has been delayed for years, despite the fact most native Hawaiians are Christian and don't even engage in the practices this project is alleged to disrupt. In reality what happened is that activists have extracted paid consulting work from the developers to incorporate meaningless cultural activities and community outreach programs that no one will care about. A total scam.
Sure. However the phrase "In God We Trust" is the official motto of the United States. It is also the motto of the U.S. state of Florida. The motto has been included on U.S. currency since the Civil War era, and it became the official national motto in 1956 when President Dwight D. Eisenhower signed a law establishing it as such. It's interesting that the United States government is founded on the principles of religious freedom and the separation of church and state, as outlined in the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution. However, the presence of religious phrases, such as "In God We Trust" on U.S. currency and the phrase "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance, has led to debates about the extent to which the government reflects a religious preference. these phrases may be seen as promoting a particular religious viewpoint and that they could be perceived as violating the principle of separation of church and state.
These are good points -- I think that they reflect a preference of religion, but not of a particular religion, which is even more problematic in my opinion. But, I am not for these other displays of religiosity either.
My point is that your argument loses its foundation because the Government consistently demonstrates a clear preference for a particular religion. Despite having listened to the concerns of Creationists, their suggestions are never put into practice. This raises the question of why the government should not extend the same consideration (listen to) to other religious minority groups, which you criticize. In my humble opinion, it appears to be more of a bias against these minority communities.
The Navajo Nation is essentially a semi independent country within the US. Hearing their objections is reasonable and respectful. They came to the right conclusion. This is a complaint about nothing. Had the Vatican sent a delegation they’d probably have heard them out too
Sometimes "science" and "scientists" can act as religiously as any religion. I've dealt with many science ideologues in my lifetime, and they can be as narrow-minded and self-centered as any religious zealot. Science as the pursuit of truth applies to self-proclaimed scientists as much as anyone. To paraphrase the old saying -- "Scientist, know thyself and thy motivations."
You are certainly correct about one group of "scientists": the Union of Concerned Scientists. They are headquartered in Berkeley (simply shocking) and are nothing more than a bunch of dyed in the wool Marxists whose sole motivation is to promote a socialist takeover of the United States.
You probably studied "women's studies" in college, if you went to college (which I am more and more doubting). The persons who engage in "scientism" are more often the amateurs who don't know much. Actual scientists, like myself, know the limits of our pursuit.
While I am in agreement with aligning to the original constitution, and dissolving patriarchal practices in any religion, NASA and the White House are withholding so much information in regards to space travel and their true intentions. It is therefore, hard to separate the actual alliance or non alliance between the Navajo and politicians. Native Religions know more about the stars than most religions present today and my intuition tells me that the White House is in great need of what the Navajo know. Also, the government has a hold, along with NASA, on everything , every aspect of our lives. They aren’t just freely allowing whoever has the money to fly to the moon to do so. There is so much they have been hiding. It cannot be that straight forward. Unless I’m misunderstanding you there. Thank you for your intelligent article on this. There does need to be conversation.
Native religions know more about the stars - wow. Complete nonsense.
When the Europeans came to North America, the native peoples did not have the wheel, did not work metal, did little agriculture. The reason that native people lost the war is that the cultures of North America were 10,000 years behind the cultures of Europe and Asia.
Enough with the mindless veneration of native people.
It has been suggested that cultures in the Americas lacked the wheel (except on children's toys) because of the absence of suitable animals to pull wheeled vehicles.
Complex, sedentary agricultural societies existed in the part of North America known today as central and southern Mexico before the arrival of the Europeans. Those societies also worked metals.
Bibliography:
Origins of Agriculture - Early Agricultural Societies - Mesoamerica
Prior to the arrival of Europeans on the American continent in the fifteenth century, agricultural practices were fundamentally different than those that later defined a major aspect of the American economy. Preceding the appearance of the Spanish, French, and English, there were no draft animals to harness to the plow; horses, cattle, and oxen were all brought to the New World by the European explorers and colonists. North America's one indigenous animal large enough to have served such a purpose was the bison or buffalo. However, the bison was never domesticated. Native peoples in the New World also lacked iron and steel that could be turned into plows and cultivators. Despite the absence of these "essentials," late-prehistoric societies throughout many areas of the United States (including Oklahoma) developed extensive and sophisticated agricultural systems.
Beginning around 4,000 years ago in the eastern United States, prehistoric societies began to manipulate indigenous plants such as sunflower, gourd, chenopodium (pigweed), and amaranth (goosefoot), promoting the development of larger fruits and seeds. In the southwestern United States tropical plants introduced from Mexico, such as corn, beans, and squash, were being cultivated. By roughly 2,000 years ago, many American Indian societies were cultivating small garden plots, raising the above-noted varieties, and producing other edible cultigens as well as plants for ceremonial and medicinal purposes (i.e., tobacco). These peoples typically situated their hamlets and villages in stream valleys where fertile soils aided in nurturing crops. Garden areas were prepared by burning off vegetation and clearing the area of trees that could shade crops. Seeds were planted using bone and wooden digging sticks. The burning of fields provided fertilizer and slowed down the invasion of weeds. This technique, called slash-and-burn, has been used by small-scale agricultural societies for thousands of years.
With the establishment of larger, increasingly sedentary settlements beginning around 1,000 years ago, there was a greater need for agricultural produce as well as for crop surplus to carry people through the winter months. This resulted in a pronounced intensification of agricultural production. As witnessed at the time of European contact, large agricultural fields produced corn, beans, squash, and a variety of other plants that were the mainstay of human subsistence.
In the eastern United States it is likely that there were two plantings annually and that there was intensive field maintenance. Most of these societies also practiced agriculturally based ceremonies such as the busque (busk, green corn ceremony). This agricultural intensity is evidenced by the large number of stone, bone, and shell hoes found at most village sites, reflecting the weeding and tilling of the soil. In the Southwest, irrigation systems were designed to provide water for cultivated fields.
At the time of European contact agricultural societies flourished from Arizona and New Mexico to the southeastern United States and in the Great Plains, Midwest, and Northeast.
Archaeological evidence has not revealed metal smelting or alloying of metals by pre-Columbian native peoples north of the Rio Grande; however, they did use native copper extensively.[43]
Old Copper Culture
As widely accepted as this statement might be, it should not be considered synonymous with a lack of metal objects, as it points out native copper was relatively abundant, particularly in the Great Lakes region.[3] The latest glacial period had resulted in the scouring of copper bearing rocks. Once the ice retreated, these were readily available for use in a variety of sizes.[3] Copper was shaped via cold hammering into objects from very early dates (Archaic period in the Great Lakes region: 8000–1000 BCE). There is also evidence of actual mining of copper veins (Old Copper Complex), but disagreement exists as to the dates.[3]
Extraction would have been extremely difficult. Hammerstones may have been used to break off pieces small enough to be worked. This labor-intensive process might have been eased by building a fire on top of the deposit, then quickly dousing the hot rock with water, creating small cracks. This process could be repeated to create more small cracks.[citation needed]
The copper could then be cold-hammered into shape, which would make it brittle, or hammered and heated in an annealing process to avoid this. The final object would then have to be ground and sharpened using local sandstone. Numerous bars have also been found, possibly indicative[original research?] of trade for which their shaping into a bar would also serve as proof of quality.
Great Lake artifacts found in the Eastern Woodlands of North America seem to indicate there were widespread trading networks by 1000 BCE. Progressively the usage of copper for tools decreases with more jewelry and adornments being found. This is believed to be indicative of social changes to a more hierarchical society.[3] Thousands of copper mining pits have been found along the lake shore of Lake Superior, and on Isle Royale. These pits may have been in use as far back as 8,000 years ago. This copper was mined and then made into objects such as heavy spear points and tools of all kinds. It was also made into mysterious crescent objects that some archaeologists believe were religious or ceremonial items. The crescents were too fragile for utilitarian use, and many have 28 or 29 notches along the inner edge, the approximate number of days in a lunar month.[44]
The Old Copper Culture mainly flourished in Ontario and Minnesota. However at least 50 Old Copper items, including spear points and ceremonial crescents have been discovered in Manitoba. A few more in Saskatchewan, and at least one, a crescent, has turned up in Alberta, 2,000 kilometres from its homeland in Ontario. It is most likely that these copper items arrived in the plains as trade goods rather than people of the Old Copper Culture moving into these new places. However from one excavated site in eastern Manitoba we can see that at least some people were moving northwest. At a site near Bissett archaeologists have found copper tools, weapons, and waste material of manufacture, along with a large nugget of raw copper. This site however was dated to around 4,000 years ago, a time of cooler climate when the boreal forest's treeline moved much further south. Though if these migrants moved with their metallurgy up the Winnipeg River at this time they may have continued onward, into Lake Winnipeg, and the Saskatchewan River system.[44]
This Old Copper Culture never became particularity advanced, and never discovered the principle of creating alloys. This means that many, though they could make metal objects and weapons, continued to use their flint tools, which could maintain a sharper edge for much longer. The unalloyed copper could simply not compete, and in the later days of the Old Copper Culture the metal was almost exclusively used for ceremonial items.[44]
However this Great Lake model as a unique source of copper and of copper technologies remaining somewhat static for over 6,000 years has recently come into some level of criticism, particularly since other deposits seem to have been available to ancient North Americans, even if much smaller.[46][47]
During the Mississippian period (800–1600 CE, varying locally), elites at major political and religious centers throughout the midwestern and southeastern United States used copper ornamentation as a sign of their status by crafting the sacred material into representations connected with the Chiefly Warrior cult of the Southeastern Ceremonial Complex (S.E.C.C.).[48] This ornamentation includes Mississippian copper plates, repousséd plates of beaten copper now found as far afield as Alabama, Florida, Georgia, Illinois, Mississippi, Oklahoma, and Tennessee. Some of the more famous of the plates are of raptorial birds and avian-themed dancing warriors. These plates, such as the Rogan plates from Etowah, the Spiro plates from the Spiro in Oklahoma, and the Wulfing cache from southeast Missouri, were instrumental in the development of the archaeological concept known as the S.E.C.C.[48]
The only Mississippian culture site where a copper workshop has been located by archaeologists is Cahokia in western Illinois, where a copper workshop dating to the Moorehead Phase (c. 1200 CE) was identified at Mound 34. Gregory Perino identified the site in 1956 and archaeologists subsequently excavated it.[49]
Numerous copper fragments were found at the site; metallographic analysis indicated that Mississippian copper workers worked copper into thin sheet through repeated hammering and annealing, a process that could be successful over open-pit wood fires.[49]
"Those societies also worked metals." if they worked metals why were they so eager to trade for western knives and tools?
the Aztecs one of the more developed groups in the Western hemisphere used obsidian for their war clubs, if they practiced metallurgy dont you think they would have created knives, swords, axes etc?
Wow. Just wow. Watch where you step, there’s probably a buried indigenous baby. With small pox from those enlightened Europeans, as bodies don’t decompose anymore due to the chemical warfare brought on by enlightened Europeans. I’m done.
No need to pretend that European settlers were morally more advanced than Native Americans but on the other hand, yes, they WERE more technologically and scientifically advanced. And for all the beautiful mythology of their religions, no, I don’t think Native American religions encompass nearly as much true knowledge about the nature of stars, our solar system, exoplanets, galaxies, black holes, pulsars, etc., as modern astrophysics does.
If it’s any consolation I don’t think the equally beautiful religions of ancient Greece or Egypt or Mesopotamia did either.
Your comment seems to prove the author’s point. Why should Navajo etiology and traditional beliefs take precedence over other traditional religious belief systems when the First Amendment dictates that such precedence is unconstitutional?
You say that “native religions know more about the stars than most religions present today” which begs the question how religions come to “know” anything. Most religions rely on “revealed truth” rather than shared observations, which is or should be NASA’s wheelhouse. If the Navajo tradition is consistent with shared observation then fine, the contribution should be gratefully accepted. But if it is more akin to “revealed truth,” then the US Constitution should prohibit NASA or any agency of government from giving it precedence.
That is not to say that Native traditions do not lack value or should not be respected, only that there should be an even playing field when it comes to religious beliefs whatever their source.
NASA does not rely on shared observations. It relies on spending millions of tax payer dollars to desecrate, misinform, and conceal. If any member of a religion wants to hang out with NASA, let them. The government has now allowed gender re assignment into the mix, for example. Is that a shared observation? I suppose. I observe that there are many young people very confused. I don’t mean to bring up unrelated topics, but, I don’t believe a word of what NASA sais. I believe any Native Elder when they speak of their wisdom when it comes to the stars. I believe them because I have my own experience in the matter. If another doesn’t, they don’t. Some people have very personal experiences with Jesus, me, not so much. The government has taken the place of religion. That, and psychiatry. I could go on....
My youngest daughter is a research scientist at NASA in remote sensing. I can assure you that gender ideology has no role in her work and that of her colleagues, at least. It is solidly and exclusively observational.
You sound shrill and a bit unfocused. NASA is not perfect, and as a government entity is not immune from political and ideological interference. But as the recent kerfuffle at Harvard shows, neither are private institutions, no matter how revered. Harvard is going down the tubes at least as fast, if not faster. Most scientists at NASA are just trying to do their work.
You’d do well to stay on topic. I understandyour anger and frustration, but it is hindering your effectiveness.
I appreciate your comment. And I’m glad to be proved wrong. I agree with you that scientists are just trying to do their jobs, and I shall stay on topic. Why was the topic? Oh yes, ashes in space.... lol.
Well said. I cannot help but picture an urn being flung around the galaxy, hitting a satellite, causing a space fire ..... which we mistake as Jesus returning. Now that’s on topic no? It’s late and my imagination is going off.
Judging by your profile you may have some weighty topics on your mind and be searching for answers. I figure the effort will probably be futile, but as a convert to Christianity I recommend you include it in your search for truth.
This is so incorrect, it's not even wrong (to borrow from Wolfgang Pauli).
One of the criteria of NASA's public funding is that ALL of the data it produces must be shared publicly. Some of it with immediate effect; the rest of it within a certain time limit, typically 1 year.
The reason for the latter is to give the scientists, who put the work into proposing and justifying a particular set of observations with HST or JWST or whatever, a 1-year head start in analysing the resulting data and publishing their results. Scientific credit goes to "who got there first", so you always want to get your results out before your rivals can pip you - they would get the same results if they got their hands on the same data.
The bottom line is that it's all public and unhidden. That's how amateur astronomers, for example, access the original raw datasets, apply newer tools, and produce skilfully reprocessed images from the likes of HST, SOHO and Juno space missions.
I agree. I also feel the US has desecrated so much of the Native Americans sacred earth without much consideration. Perhaps a pause would be wise in this situation.
But the Moon is not part of their (or anyone’s) “sacred earth”. It’s a separate planetary body formed 4.5 billion years ago that orbits the Earth from 250,000 miles away and has never been permanently inhabited by any creature alive on Earth, including humans. It doesn’t belong to anyone.
Native Americans need to adopt a position of greater humility here. They are not human beings whose views on moral / philosophical / cosmogenic topics have any reason to be taken more seriously than the views of other human beings alive at any point in Earth’s history.
You should read some history. Since your comments indicate that you have read none, really any history will do. Until about 1800, wars of conquest were common. Waves of nomadic tribes out of Central Asia went thru Europe on 3-4 occasions. This is history. Whining Wokey Jokey Fokey like you don't know much about history, as the song goes. That's why you are a Jokey.
You need not look to the moon to see some tribal/government canoodling. President Biden proclaimed the Baaj Nwaavjo I’tah Kukveni National Monument surrounding the Grand Canyon a few months ago, pulling almost a million acres out of USFS/BLM multiple use management and dedicating it to the preservation of Indian archeological sites under the Antiquities Act. The Navajos along with a couple other tribes were worried about uranium mining, radium pollution of water sources, protection of Native American burial sites and artifacts/ruins, and access for religious ceremonies. And here, you go down the rabbit hole: Every issue they raised was already covered by extant federal law and was actively being managed. National Monument status added nothing in terms of additional statutory protection. But it did set up a Tribal Commission giving the tribes a preferential role in management--and if it is modeled on the Bears Ears commission, the feds say straight out that they will do everything in their power to shield its work from the Freedom of Information Act. As to uranium mining, the one active mine is expressly grandfathered in, and the proclamation is incredibly vague about the thousands of existing mining claims in the area. Perhaps that's because it would be a federal takings to abrogate those claims, meaning that every patented claim would need due process and reasonable compensation for its property rights. But wait, there's more: these Monument proclamations are exempt from NEPA analysis; the existing data on radium pollution reveals that natural leaching, not mining, is the primary and historic source. And while the media reports talked about grandfathering in existing public uses, the Proclamation says what it has to say under the law: everything is subordinated to the preservation purpose of the Act. As to what that looks like, consider the Red Butte Management Area created by the Kaibab National Forest at the tribes' behest: that area is closed to vehicular recovery of elk (which is broadly permitted in Arizona game management units); off-limits to any commercial activity; and may be closed to public access at the tribe's demand--ostensibly to protect religious ceremonies, but because their ceremonies are secret, nobody knows what that means. And if you think that Monument status creates a wonderful tourist and educational attraction, think again. Bill Clinton pulled the same vote-buying game when he designated the Agua Fria National Monument 24 years ago--and to be fair, there are some really cool ruins around there. But a quarter century later, the "monument" is one crappy web page hosted by the BLM giving directions to a crappy road leading to a crappy trail to one ruin complex. No staff, no visitor center, no nada. Except...he bought votes. And that's exactly what is going on with Biden: he's doing his dangdest to turn Utah and Arizona blue, and trading off our multiple use public access lands to do it. I'd say more, but have to await the FOIA response that the USFS has been stonewalling since last October. And I'll make a prediction: if we get a Democrat Congress and President next election, you will see reparations suddenly land on the table, and at least a portion of this new Monument will become trust lands for the adjacent tribes. Biden pretty much telegraphed this in saying that monument designation and preferential management access was a "first step." The tribal commission could easily concoct a justification for, say, the former Tusayan Ranger District becoming "returned" to the Navajos. And don't think this deconstruction of our public lands will end here: if you look at the justifications claimed to take this million acres of land, you'll find they apply in almost every respect to any other million acres of federal land in the Southwest. Congress failed us mightily in handing a president unilateral authority to override Congressionally-directed multiple use land management.
This is yet another demonstration of what happens when we veer from common sense, when we start to let ideology drive our decision making. We get universities admitting students based upon demographics more than merit. We get boys defeating girls in female sporting events. We get people dressed as cats and dogs in schools. We get increasing animosity between Blacks and Whites, Indigenous and non-indigenous. We get “traditional knowledge” that means…not much.
When I yearn for the past, it is mit only for the music and the freedom of youth. It is for the common sense, clarity and reason.
This is interesting and the same trend is happening in Canada - under the guise of reconciliation - when no one is becoming reconciled to the mess the gov's made of First Nations policies. I often wonder why this religion and land acknowledgements are being included now when we had to work hard to get rid of the pledge to the UK Monarchy and the Lord's Prayer in schools. As someone who suffered from religious PTSD, I'm really not that keen and it's starting to seem as formulaic as those.
> I often wonder why this religion and land acknowledgements are being included now when we had to work hard to get rid of the pledge to the UK Monarchy and the Lord's Prayer in schools.
a) Who can be so self- indulgent as to need their remains deposited on the moon?
And that probably costs some money. There are needy people on this planet suffering and dying that your money could help.
b) agreed we don't need to honor a whim of some Native Americans about not putting remains on the moon. It seems like an exercise in self absorption to request this. Not to deprecated all Native American spirituality but there has to be a limit.
Is it true that certain tribes have made land claims based on the fact that their ancestors were buried all around only to have DNA reveal that in fact the people claimed as "ancestors" were the victims of the tribes making the land claim?
I don't know about that specific scenario, but I do know there have been competing claims as to which tribe could properly claim discovered remains. Years ago, the old mill in Eagar had an underground diesel fuel leak, which happened to permeate a previously undetected burial ground, and there was quite a fuss over who got to have the remains reburied and where.
Another example is the area of addiction recovery. Rehabs funded with federal dollars proudly tout their sweat lodges, talking circles, and sage burning for native clients. But try, as a therapist, to remind a deeply Christian grandma about a Bible verse pertaining to her grief counseling---not with federal dollars!!! One issue here is the definition of religion. See historian Tom Holland about how this word is uniquely Western.
One discipline in cultural anthropology is the study of human activities and belief systems that fall under the category of religion. This is not an attempt to determine whether there is a correct religion. Rather, it seeks to understand human behavior that can be categorized as religious across many cultures. It includes the belief in unseen supernatural forces and adherence to to strictly enforced taboos. Consistent with human nature there is usually a hierarchy of "clergy" who acquire considerable power and authority which they exert on members of their culture. It seems like it is human nature for individuals to embrace these belief systems and follow such religious edicts. In current western cultures many people exhibit religious behavior while condemning formal religion. An example is the fervor that some people display when they consider the issue of climate change. I've had lengthy interactions with some of them and can only characterize them as religious zealots.
Japan, the Soviet Union, China, India and the US have now all landed a spacecraft on the moon. I think giving consideration to each nations various religion concerns and objection is not as important as making sure the moon is not "claimed" by any one of them, divided up or fought after.
This seems very sensible. We do not want to export ownership ideas from Earth to space. The moon, if it is to be "colonized", should be done in a international perspective.
How about don't colonize the Moon at all?
NOPE. The moon is the staging ground as we move into the universe. In 100 years, several thousand people will live there for extended periods.
"NOPE" says you. So what? You're an ideologue, face up to it. You're also living in a dream world. Raised on Star Trek philosophy, no doubt. I always wondered, as I pursued my own studies in science, Why is it that humans can't be bothered to deal with the mess they've made of their own planet, they want to take their mess to other planets? Have fun living on the Moon, genius.
Geez, let people do what they want. The person who doesn’t even want to leave people the freedom to live on the moon is the mindless ideologue here.
LOL. "Freedom"
It's not going to be regular folks like you who'll have the 'freedom' to live on the moon. Do you know what conditions there are like? Imagine the cost. Nope, only the trillionaires and their slaves will ever go near the moon.
I'll put you on the "clueless cluck" list. Honey, our entire computer revolution is built on techniques learned to support our space effort.
Really if anybody desires to colonize it that's fine by me. I prefer Earth personally.
I hope you don’t include individual rights of ownership in that.
"making sure the moon is not "claimed" by any one of them, divided up or fought after."
This is already safely dealt with by https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outer_Space_Treaty
-> Quote: Article II of the treaty explicitly forbids any government from claiming a celestial body such as the Moon or a planet as its own territory, whether by declaration, occupation, or "any other means".
You can also see this religious preference for indigenous beliefs in play in the bizarre battle over construction of the thirty meter telescope on Mauna Kea in Hawaii. One of the primary objections made by activists (really just a handful of academics with dubious credentials) was that the mountain was 'sacred' to native Hawaiians and the construction would prevent loosely defined 'native cultural practices'. Both federal and state governments took this nonsense seriously and construction has been delayed for years, despite the fact most native Hawaiians are Christian and don't even engage in the practices this project is alleged to disrupt. In reality what happened is that activists have extracted paid consulting work from the developers to incorporate meaningless cultural activities and community outreach programs that no one will care about. A total scam.
Sure. However the phrase "In God We Trust" is the official motto of the United States. It is also the motto of the U.S. state of Florida. The motto has been included on U.S. currency since the Civil War era, and it became the official national motto in 1956 when President Dwight D. Eisenhower signed a law establishing it as such. It's interesting that the United States government is founded on the principles of religious freedom and the separation of church and state, as outlined in the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution. However, the presence of religious phrases, such as "In God We Trust" on U.S. currency and the phrase "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance, has led to debates about the extent to which the government reflects a religious preference. these phrases may be seen as promoting a particular religious viewpoint and that they could be perceived as violating the principle of separation of church and state.
These are good points -- I think that they reflect a preference of religion, but not of a particular religion, which is even more problematic in my opinion. But, I am not for these other displays of religiosity either.
> which is even more problematic in my opinion.
Why? You really should learn more about the nation's (Lockean) founding philosophy.
My point is that your argument loses its foundation because the Government consistently demonstrates a clear preference for a particular religion. Despite having listened to the concerns of Creationists, their suggestions are never put into practice. This raises the question of why the government should not extend the same consideration (listen to) to other religious minority groups, which you criticize. In my humble opinion, it appears to be more of a bias against these minority communities.
The Navajo Nation is essentially a semi independent country within the US. Hearing their objections is reasonable and respectful. They came to the right conclusion. This is a complaint about nothing. Had the Vatican sent a delegation they’d probably have heard them out too
Sometimes "science" and "scientists" can act as religiously as any religion. I've dealt with many science ideologues in my lifetime, and they can be as narrow-minded and self-centered as any religious zealot. Science as the pursuit of truth applies to self-proclaimed scientists as much as anyone. To paraphrase the old saying -- "Scientist, know thyself and thy motivations."
You are certainly correct about one group of "scientists": the Union of Concerned Scientists. They are headquartered in Berkeley (simply shocking) and are nothing more than a bunch of dyed in the wool Marxists whose sole motivation is to promote a socialist takeover of the United States.
You probably studied "women's studies" in college, if you went to college (which I am more and more doubting). The persons who engage in "scientism" are more often the amateurs who don't know much. Actual scientists, like myself, know the limits of our pursuit.
While I am in agreement with aligning to the original constitution, and dissolving patriarchal practices in any religion, NASA and the White House are withholding so much information in regards to space travel and their true intentions. It is therefore, hard to separate the actual alliance or non alliance between the Navajo and politicians. Native Religions know more about the stars than most religions present today and my intuition tells me that the White House is in great need of what the Navajo know. Also, the government has a hold, along with NASA, on everything , every aspect of our lives. They aren’t just freely allowing whoever has the money to fly to the moon to do so. There is so much they have been hiding. It cannot be that straight forward. Unless I’m misunderstanding you there. Thank you for your intelligent article on this. There does need to be conversation.
Native religions know more about the stars - wow. Complete nonsense.
When the Europeans came to North America, the native peoples did not have the wheel, did not work metal, did little agriculture. The reason that native people lost the war is that the cultures of North America were 10,000 years behind the cultures of Europe and Asia.
Enough with the mindless veneration of native people.
It has been suggested that cultures in the Americas lacked the wheel (except on children's toys) because of the absence of suitable animals to pull wheeled vehicles.
Complex, sedentary agricultural societies existed in the part of North America known today as central and southern Mexico before the arrival of the Europeans. Those societies also worked metals.
Bibliography:
Origins of Agriculture - Early Agricultural Societies - Mesoamerica
Britannica https://www.britannica.com/topic/agriculture/Mesoamerica
Metallurgy in pre-Columbian Mesoamerica
Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metallurgy_in_pre-Columbian_Mesoamerica
PRECONTACT AGRICULTURE.
Robert L. Brooks
The Encylopedia of Oklahoma History and Culture
Oklahoma Historical Society
https://www.okhistory.org/publications/enc/entry.php?entry=PR005
Prior to the arrival of Europeans on the American continent in the fifteenth century, agricultural practices were fundamentally different than those that later defined a major aspect of the American economy. Preceding the appearance of the Spanish, French, and English, there were no draft animals to harness to the plow; horses, cattle, and oxen were all brought to the New World by the European explorers and colonists. North America's one indigenous animal large enough to have served such a purpose was the bison or buffalo. However, the bison was never domesticated. Native peoples in the New World also lacked iron and steel that could be turned into plows and cultivators. Despite the absence of these "essentials," late-prehistoric societies throughout many areas of the United States (including Oklahoma) developed extensive and sophisticated agricultural systems.
Beginning around 4,000 years ago in the eastern United States, prehistoric societies began to manipulate indigenous plants such as sunflower, gourd, chenopodium (pigweed), and amaranth (goosefoot), promoting the development of larger fruits and seeds. In the southwestern United States tropical plants introduced from Mexico, such as corn, beans, and squash, were being cultivated. By roughly 2,000 years ago, many American Indian societies were cultivating small garden plots, raising the above-noted varieties, and producing other edible cultigens as well as plants for ceremonial and medicinal purposes (i.e., tobacco). These peoples typically situated their hamlets and villages in stream valleys where fertile soils aided in nurturing crops. Garden areas were prepared by burning off vegetation and clearing the area of trees that could shade crops. Seeds were planted using bone and wooden digging sticks. The burning of fields provided fertilizer and slowed down the invasion of weeds. This technique, called slash-and-burn, has been used by small-scale agricultural societies for thousands of years.
With the establishment of larger, increasingly sedentary settlements beginning around 1,000 years ago, there was a greater need for agricultural produce as well as for crop surplus to carry people through the winter months. This resulted in a pronounced intensification of agricultural production. As witnessed at the time of European contact, large agricultural fields produced corn, beans, squash, and a variety of other plants that were the mainstay of human subsistence.
In the eastern United States it is likely that there were two plantings annually and that there was intensive field maintenance. Most of these societies also practiced agriculturally based ceremonies such as the busque (busk, green corn ceremony). This agricultural intensity is evidenced by the large number of stone, bone, and shell hoes found at most village sites, reflecting the weeding and tilling of the soil. In the Southwest, irrigation systems were designed to provide water for cultivated fields.
At the time of European contact agricultural societies flourished from Arizona and New Mexico to the southeastern United States and in the Great Plains, Midwest, and Northeast.
METALLURGY IN PRE-COLUMBIAN AMERICA
Northern America
Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metallurgy_in_pre-Columbian_America#Further_reading
Archaeological evidence has not revealed metal smelting or alloying of metals by pre-Columbian native peoples north of the Rio Grande; however, they did use native copper extensively.[43]
Old Copper Culture
As widely accepted as this statement might be, it should not be considered synonymous with a lack of metal objects, as it points out native copper was relatively abundant, particularly in the Great Lakes region.[3] The latest glacial period had resulted in the scouring of copper bearing rocks. Once the ice retreated, these were readily available for use in a variety of sizes.[3] Copper was shaped via cold hammering into objects from very early dates (Archaic period in the Great Lakes region: 8000–1000 BCE). There is also evidence of actual mining of copper veins (Old Copper Complex), but disagreement exists as to the dates.[3]
Extraction would have been extremely difficult. Hammerstones may have been used to break off pieces small enough to be worked. This labor-intensive process might have been eased by building a fire on top of the deposit, then quickly dousing the hot rock with water, creating small cracks. This process could be repeated to create more small cracks.[citation needed]
The copper could then be cold-hammered into shape, which would make it brittle, or hammered and heated in an annealing process to avoid this. The final object would then have to be ground and sharpened using local sandstone. Numerous bars have also been found, possibly indicative[original research?] of trade for which their shaping into a bar would also serve as proof of quality.
Great Lake artifacts found in the Eastern Woodlands of North America seem to indicate there were widespread trading networks by 1000 BCE. Progressively the usage of copper for tools decreases with more jewelry and adornments being found. This is believed to be indicative of social changes to a more hierarchical society.[3] Thousands of copper mining pits have been found along the lake shore of Lake Superior, and on Isle Royale. These pits may have been in use as far back as 8,000 years ago. This copper was mined and then made into objects such as heavy spear points and tools of all kinds. It was also made into mysterious crescent objects that some archaeologists believe were religious or ceremonial items. The crescents were too fragile for utilitarian use, and many have 28 or 29 notches along the inner edge, the approximate number of days in a lunar month.[44]
The Old Copper Culture mainly flourished in Ontario and Minnesota. However at least 50 Old Copper items, including spear points and ceremonial crescents have been discovered in Manitoba. A few more in Saskatchewan, and at least one, a crescent, has turned up in Alberta, 2,000 kilometres from its homeland in Ontario. It is most likely that these copper items arrived in the plains as trade goods rather than people of the Old Copper Culture moving into these new places. However from one excavated site in eastern Manitoba we can see that at least some people were moving northwest. At a site near Bissett archaeologists have found copper tools, weapons, and waste material of manufacture, along with a large nugget of raw copper. This site however was dated to around 4,000 years ago, a time of cooler climate when the boreal forest's treeline moved much further south. Though if these migrants moved with their metallurgy up the Winnipeg River at this time they may have continued onward, into Lake Winnipeg, and the Saskatchewan River system.[44]
This Old Copper Culture never became particularity advanced, and never discovered the principle of creating alloys. This means that many, though they could make metal objects and weapons, continued to use their flint tools, which could maintain a sharper edge for much longer. The unalloyed copper could simply not compete, and in the later days of the Old Copper Culture the metal was almost exclusively used for ceremonial items.[44]
However this Great Lake model as a unique source of copper and of copper technologies remaining somewhat static for over 6,000 years has recently come into some level of criticism, particularly since other deposits seem to have been available to ancient North Americans, even if much smaller.[46][47]
During the Mississippian period (800–1600 CE, varying locally), elites at major political and religious centers throughout the midwestern and southeastern United States used copper ornamentation as a sign of their status by crafting the sacred material into representations connected with the Chiefly Warrior cult of the Southeastern Ceremonial Complex (S.E.C.C.).[48] This ornamentation includes Mississippian copper plates, repousséd plates of beaten copper now found as far afield as Alabama, Florida, Georgia, Illinois, Mississippi, Oklahoma, and Tennessee. Some of the more famous of the plates are of raptorial birds and avian-themed dancing warriors. These plates, such as the Rogan plates from Etowah, the Spiro plates from the Spiro in Oklahoma, and the Wulfing cache from southeast Missouri, were instrumental in the development of the archaeological concept known as the S.E.C.C.[48]
The only Mississippian culture site where a copper workshop has been located by archaeologists is Cahokia in western Illinois, where a copper workshop dating to the Moorehead Phase (c. 1200 CE) was identified at Mound 34. Gregory Perino identified the site in 1956 and archaeologists subsequently excavated it.[49]
Numerous copper fragments were found at the site; metallographic analysis indicated that Mississippian copper workers worked copper into thin sheet through repeated hammering and annealing, a process that could be successful over open-pit wood fires.[49]
"Those societies also worked metals." if they worked metals why were they so eager to trade for western knives and tools?
the Aztecs one of the more developed groups in the Western hemisphere used obsidian for their war clubs, if they practiced metallurgy dont you think they would have created knives, swords, axes etc?
Wow. Just wow. Watch where you step, there’s probably a buried indigenous baby. With small pox from those enlightened Europeans, as bodies don’t decompose anymore due to the chemical warfare brought on by enlightened Europeans. I’m done.
Wow, Melinda. The only thing more disturbing than a brainwashed, clueless wokist is an angry clueless wokist.
But you gotta admit that angry clueless Wokey Jokey Fokey are good for a laugh.
That's the solution, BTW, to the Wokey Jokey Fokey - we need to laugh at them. They are sooooo stupid that they are funny.
Now that was Funny LOL
You were done long ago.
No need to pretend that European settlers were morally more advanced than Native Americans but on the other hand, yes, they WERE more technologically and scientifically advanced. And for all the beautiful mythology of their religions, no, I don’t think Native American religions encompass nearly as much true knowledge about the nature of stars, our solar system, exoplanets, galaxies, black holes, pulsars, etc., as modern astrophysics does.
If it’s any consolation I don’t think the equally beautiful religions of ancient Greece or Egypt or Mesopotamia did either.
Your comment seems to prove the author’s point. Why should Navajo etiology and traditional beliefs take precedence over other traditional religious belief systems when the First Amendment dictates that such precedence is unconstitutional?
You say that “native religions know more about the stars than most religions present today” which begs the question how religions come to “know” anything. Most religions rely on “revealed truth” rather than shared observations, which is or should be NASA’s wheelhouse. If the Navajo tradition is consistent with shared observation then fine, the contribution should be gratefully accepted. But if it is more akin to “revealed truth,” then the US Constitution should prohibit NASA or any agency of government from giving it precedence.
That is not to say that Native traditions do not lack value or should not be respected, only that there should be an even playing field when it comes to religious beliefs whatever their source.
NASA does not rely on shared observations. It relies on spending millions of tax payer dollars to desecrate, misinform, and conceal. If any member of a religion wants to hang out with NASA, let them. The government has now allowed gender re assignment into the mix, for example. Is that a shared observation? I suppose. I observe that there are many young people very confused. I don’t mean to bring up unrelated topics, but, I don’t believe a word of what NASA sais. I believe any Native Elder when they speak of their wisdom when it comes to the stars. I believe them because I have my own experience in the matter. If another doesn’t, they don’t. Some people have very personal experiences with Jesus, me, not so much. The government has taken the place of religion. That, and psychiatry. I could go on....
My youngest daughter is a research scientist at NASA in remote sensing. I can assure you that gender ideology has no role in her work and that of her colleagues, at least. It is solidly and exclusively observational.
You sound shrill and a bit unfocused. NASA is not perfect, and as a government entity is not immune from political and ideological interference. But as the recent kerfuffle at Harvard shows, neither are private institutions, no matter how revered. Harvard is going down the tubes at least as fast, if not faster. Most scientists at NASA are just trying to do their work.
You’d do well to stay on topic. I understandyour anger and frustration, but it is hindering your effectiveness.
I appreciate your comment. And I’m glad to be proved wrong. I agree with you that scientists are just trying to do their jobs, and I shall stay on topic. Why was the topic? Oh yes, ashes in space.... lol.
Ashes in space are largely an irrelevant sideshow. So are Navajo beliefs about them.
Well said. I cannot help but picture an urn being flung around the galaxy, hitting a satellite, causing a space fire ..... which we mistake as Jesus returning. Now that’s on topic no? It’s late and my imagination is going off.
"space fire"
You appear to be a satire op. Are your nonsense posts written by CGT?
I wish I could put a laugh emoji in the place of the heart. :-)
Judging by your profile you may have some weighty topics on your mind and be searching for answers. I figure the effort will probably be futile, but as a convert to Christianity I recommend you include it in your search for truth.
"NASA does not rely on shared observations."
This is so incorrect, it's not even wrong (to borrow from Wolfgang Pauli).
One of the criteria of NASA's public funding is that ALL of the data it produces must be shared publicly. Some of it with immediate effect; the rest of it within a certain time limit, typically 1 year.
The reason for the latter is to give the scientists, who put the work into proposing and justifying a particular set of observations with HST or JWST or whatever, a 1-year head start in analysing the resulting data and publishing their results. Scientific credit goes to "who got there first", so you always want to get your results out before your rivals can pip you - they would get the same results if they got their hands on the same data.
The bottom line is that it's all public and unhidden. That's how amateur astronomers, for example, access the original raw datasets, apply newer tools, and produce skilfully reprocessed images from the likes of HST, SOHO and Juno space missions.
I agree. I also feel the US has desecrated so much of the Native Americans sacred earth without much consideration. Perhaps a pause would be wise in this situation.
Thank you for the article
But the Moon is not part of their (or anyone’s) “sacred earth”. It’s a separate planetary body formed 4.5 billion years ago that orbits the Earth from 250,000 miles away and has never been permanently inhabited by any creature alive on Earth, including humans. It doesn’t belong to anyone.
Native Americans need to adopt a position of greater humility here. They are not human beings whose views on moral / philosophical / cosmogenic topics have any reason to be taken more seriously than the views of other human beings alive at any point in Earth’s history.
Another wackawoo surfaces.
Yep and we are fucking proud of it. They were savages that needed to be decimated and the world is a much better place now.
You should read some history. Since your comments indicate that you have read none, really any history will do. Until about 1800, wars of conquest were common. Waves of nomadic tribes out of Central Asia went thru Europe on 3-4 occasions. This is history. Whining Wokey Jokey Fokey like you don't know much about history, as the song goes. That's why you are a Jokey.
Who says I don’t read history? Surely not wasn’t you pussy faced asshole.
😅 This is nonsense. Lol
You need not look to the moon to see some tribal/government canoodling. President Biden proclaimed the Baaj Nwaavjo I’tah Kukveni National Monument surrounding the Grand Canyon a few months ago, pulling almost a million acres out of USFS/BLM multiple use management and dedicating it to the preservation of Indian archeological sites under the Antiquities Act. The Navajos along with a couple other tribes were worried about uranium mining, radium pollution of water sources, protection of Native American burial sites and artifacts/ruins, and access for religious ceremonies. And here, you go down the rabbit hole: Every issue they raised was already covered by extant federal law and was actively being managed. National Monument status added nothing in terms of additional statutory protection. But it did set up a Tribal Commission giving the tribes a preferential role in management--and if it is modeled on the Bears Ears commission, the feds say straight out that they will do everything in their power to shield its work from the Freedom of Information Act. As to uranium mining, the one active mine is expressly grandfathered in, and the proclamation is incredibly vague about the thousands of existing mining claims in the area. Perhaps that's because it would be a federal takings to abrogate those claims, meaning that every patented claim would need due process and reasonable compensation for its property rights. But wait, there's more: these Monument proclamations are exempt from NEPA analysis; the existing data on radium pollution reveals that natural leaching, not mining, is the primary and historic source. And while the media reports talked about grandfathering in existing public uses, the Proclamation says what it has to say under the law: everything is subordinated to the preservation purpose of the Act. As to what that looks like, consider the Red Butte Management Area created by the Kaibab National Forest at the tribes' behest: that area is closed to vehicular recovery of elk (which is broadly permitted in Arizona game management units); off-limits to any commercial activity; and may be closed to public access at the tribe's demand--ostensibly to protect religious ceremonies, but because their ceremonies are secret, nobody knows what that means. And if you think that Monument status creates a wonderful tourist and educational attraction, think again. Bill Clinton pulled the same vote-buying game when he designated the Agua Fria National Monument 24 years ago--and to be fair, there are some really cool ruins around there. But a quarter century later, the "monument" is one crappy web page hosted by the BLM giving directions to a crappy road leading to a crappy trail to one ruin complex. No staff, no visitor center, no nada. Except...he bought votes. And that's exactly what is going on with Biden: he's doing his dangdest to turn Utah and Arizona blue, and trading off our multiple use public access lands to do it. I'd say more, but have to await the FOIA response that the USFS has been stonewalling since last October. And I'll make a prediction: if we get a Democrat Congress and President next election, you will see reparations suddenly land on the table, and at least a portion of this new Monument will become trust lands for the adjacent tribes. Biden pretty much telegraphed this in saying that monument designation and preferential management access was a "first step." The tribal commission could easily concoct a justification for, say, the former Tusayan Ranger District becoming "returned" to the Navajos. And don't think this deconstruction of our public lands will end here: if you look at the justifications claimed to take this million acres of land, you'll find they apply in almost every respect to any other million acres of federal land in the Southwest. Congress failed us mightily in handing a president unilateral authority to override Congressionally-directed multiple use land management.
This is yet another demonstration of what happens when we veer from common sense, when we start to let ideology drive our decision making. We get universities admitting students based upon demographics more than merit. We get boys defeating girls in female sporting events. We get people dressed as cats and dogs in schools. We get increasing animosity between Blacks and Whites, Indigenous and non-indigenous. We get “traditional knowledge” that means…not much.
When I yearn for the past, it is mit only for the music and the freedom of youth. It is for the common sense, clarity and reason.
This is interesting and the same trend is happening in Canada - under the guise of reconciliation - when no one is becoming reconciled to the mess the gov's made of First Nations policies. I often wonder why this religion and land acknowledgements are being included now when we had to work hard to get rid of the pledge to the UK Monarchy and the Lord's Prayer in schools. As someone who suffered from religious PTSD, I'm really not that keen and it's starting to seem as formulaic as those.
> I often wonder why this religion and land acknowledgements are being included now when we had to work hard to get rid of the pledge to the UK Monarchy and the Lord's Prayer in schools.
You left out a "because" from that sentence.
My thoughts:
a) Who can be so self- indulgent as to need their remains deposited on the moon?
And that probably costs some money. There are needy people on this planet suffering and dying that your money could help.
b) agreed we don't need to honor a whim of some Native Americans about not putting remains on the moon. It seems like an exercise in self absorption to request this. Not to deprecated all Native American spirituality but there has to be a limit.
Is it true that certain tribes have made land claims based on the fact that their ancestors were buried all around only to have DNA reveal that in fact the people claimed as "ancestors" were the victims of the tribes making the land claim?
I don't know about that specific scenario, but I do know there have been competing claims as to which tribe could properly claim discovered remains. Years ago, the old mill in Eagar had an underground diesel fuel leak, which happened to permeate a previously undetected burial ground, and there was quite a fuss over who got to have the remains reburied and where.