Your comment "If that were true wouldn’t domestic violent be more prominent in houses, given most houses are sober?" made no sense.
You said earlier that "...alcohol causes severe domestic violence" and now you say more reasonably "...alcohol’s correlation to enabling violent behaviour".
That is my point, but you seem to want to ban alcoho…
Your comment "If that were true wouldn’t domestic violent be more prominent in houses, given most houses are sober?" made no sense.
You said earlier that "...alcohol causes severe domestic violence" and now you say more reasonably "...alcohol’s correlation to enabling violent behaviour".
That is my point, but you seem to want to ban alcohol and that is plain foolish.
The problem is the culture, not the alcohol, and you appear to admit this. I repeat what I have said before, you have to deal with the root cause, the heart of mankind, not the superficial.
And if you’re unconvinced by my claims here is a recent paper that summarised violence in Indigenous Australian communities. Note the careful wording in the section about violence against women:
“Violence against Indigenous women is partly or completely fuelled by harmful use of alcohol. The rate alcohol-related violence or violent incidents occurred at 52% in the Northern Territory(26). The physical abuse, especially assaults against Indigenous women is often committed by heavy drunk husband in the remote Northern Territory communities (16).”
No, I don’t admit this. You appear confused. It’s the way that culture relates to alcohol that is the problem. Cultures that have excessive alcohol intake as part of their culture suffer from social problems related to alcoholism, including domestic violence in far greater numbers than those cultures where alcohol consumption is non-existent or low.
As to your three comments to my one, I reply here for ease of reference.
I have had a look at some of your other comments to try and understand where you are coming from. You don’t post any articles or set out anything about yourself. I would suggest you do give some basic information to help people who might wish to engage with you.
However I understand you live in Australia and perhaps part of the indigenous community. I am very sorry to hear about the alcoholism driven domestic violence in your family.
You indicated to Jon Midget in this post that you a religious person and believe men and women created in the image and likeness of God. I believe that too.
As to your comments I would say the following;
Re link and “Violence against Indigenous women is partly or completely fuelled by harmful use of alcohol.”
Alcohol is a fuel (and indeed can be used in motor vehicles) and whilst banning it will stop some people having access to it, this does not deal with the causes as to why people took it up in the first place.
I have not looked in depth at all the issues the indigenous community have faced over the years, but I am well aware they suffered abuse and being forced off the land by the incomers, so the problem is much deeper than just alcohol abuse.
There is clearly a long history of injustice and which must be addressed to resolve the problems.
This is not to say alcohol restrictions won’t help limit the outward effects, but they are not the root cause of why people took to alcohol in the first place.
Even the link you provided says “There is no single interventional approach that could potentially be recommended due to complex nature of evidences.”
In your second comment you say you say that you don’t admit that culture regarding alcohol is the problem and then go on to talk about the cultural problems! And you say ‘excessive alcohol intake’ is the issue, which is my point exactly.
And you say I am confused?! You have contradicted yourself.
As regards your third comment I do not deny alcohol is a fuel to add flames to the fire of hatred or despair in the heart but you wish to deny the heart issues, the essence inside a person.
If you are someone who follows Christ then you will know His teaching.
“Do you still not understand?” Jesus asked. “Do you not yet realize that whatever enters the mouth goes into the stomach and then is eliminated? But the things that come out of the mouth come from the heart, and these things defile a man.
The apostle Paul says in his letter to the Ephesians
“Do not get drunk on wine, which leads to reckless indiscretion. Instead, be filled with the Spirit.”
Again in the Psalms it talks about the Lord making wine ‘that gladdens the heart of man...”
You said “If you were right, we would see more cases of domestic violence broadly speaking and more cases of domestic violence in homes where no alcohol is present.”
Domestic violence takes many forms, not just physical. It might also be emotional or economic for example. Religious abuse occurs and alcohol is often banned in such homes.
I have said my piece, I can say no more to you. I will not reply again.
I didn’t advocate for banning alcohol, you drew that conclusion from me saying that prohibitionistics were correct in correlating alcohol to violence.
It is simply true that most domestic violence is correlated to some kind of drug abuse, most commonly alcohol. Men that wouldn’t ordinarily hit women and children when they are sober, turn into violent monsters after drinking alcohol. Their hearts are not the problem and they often regret their behaviour. Their alcoholism is the problem. You appear to deny this entirely.
If you were right, we would see more cases of domestic violence broadly speaking and more cases of domestic violence in homes where no alcohol is present. But statistically this just isn’t true. For some people alcohol cannot be a substance they can ever consume.
To further my point, the indigenous Australian community in the Northern Territory had an imposed alcohol ban in their communities to help curb issues of domestic violence, child neglect and violent crime. These alcohol bans were recently overturned and we have seen a significant increase in domestic violence, violent crime, child neglect and alcohol related youth violence. So much so the Territory had to employ curfews and call in for additional police resources to manage this issue whilst the community had to effectively lock down their shops and houses out of fear.
Don’t tell me alcohol is a benign substance and somehow changing the hearts of these Indigenous youths is the problem here. They’re committing violent acts because they’re suffering from parental neglect because their fathers and mothers are either dead from alcoholism or are engaging in domestic violence in the home, causing the child to flee and seek refuge in violent gangs. All of this could he resolved by removing alcohol from these communities.
On both sides of my family I have close examples of alcoholism driven domestic violence. My cousin was beaten by her alcohol husband and had to leave him. My uncle beat his wife and neglected his children due to his alcoholism. He’s now sober and regrets his actions but the damage has been done.
The “heart of mankind” is a weak argument in light of the evidence. If the problem were that easy, we would have solved it by now. The truth simply is alcohol is a powerful drug, we don’t need it to live, in fact it’s deleterious to our general health, and it causes social problems. Wholescale prohibition is not the solution but assuming all people can have ready access to alcohol is naive.
Your comment "If that were true wouldn’t domestic violent be more prominent in houses, given most houses are sober?" made no sense.
You said earlier that "...alcohol causes severe domestic violence" and now you say more reasonably "...alcohol’s correlation to enabling violent behaviour".
That is my point, but you seem to want to ban alcohol and that is plain foolish.
The problem is the culture, not the alcohol, and you appear to admit this. I repeat what I have said before, you have to deal with the root cause, the heart of mankind, not the superficial.
And if you’re unconvinced by my claims here is a recent paper that summarised violence in Indigenous Australian communities. Note the careful wording in the section about violence against women:
“Violence against Indigenous women is partly or completely fuelled by harmful use of alcohol. The rate alcohol-related violence or violent incidents occurred at 52% in the Northern Territory(26). The physical abuse, especially assaults against Indigenous women is often committed by heavy drunk husband in the remote Northern Territory communities (16).”
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4449401/#:~:text=The%20rate%20alcohol%2Drelated%20violence,Northern%20Territory%20communities%20(16).
“The problem is the culture, not the alcohol”
No, I don’t admit this. You appear confused. It’s the way that culture relates to alcohol that is the problem. Cultures that have excessive alcohol intake as part of their culture suffer from social problems related to alcoholism, including domestic violence in far greater numbers than those cultures where alcohol consumption is non-existent or low.
Dear Emwisnie
As to your three comments to my one, I reply here for ease of reference.
I have had a look at some of your other comments to try and understand where you are coming from. You don’t post any articles or set out anything about yourself. I would suggest you do give some basic information to help people who might wish to engage with you.
However I understand you live in Australia and perhaps part of the indigenous community. I am very sorry to hear about the alcoholism driven domestic violence in your family.
You indicated to Jon Midget in this post that you a religious person and believe men and women created in the image and likeness of God. I believe that too.
As to your comments I would say the following;
Re link and “Violence against Indigenous women is partly or completely fuelled by harmful use of alcohol.”
Alcohol is a fuel (and indeed can be used in motor vehicles) and whilst banning it will stop some people having access to it, this does not deal with the causes as to why people took it up in the first place.
I have not looked in depth at all the issues the indigenous community have faced over the years, but I am well aware they suffered abuse and being forced off the land by the incomers, so the problem is much deeper than just alcohol abuse.
There is clearly a long history of injustice and which must be addressed to resolve the problems.
This is not to say alcohol restrictions won’t help limit the outward effects, but they are not the root cause of why people took to alcohol in the first place.
Even the link you provided says “There is no single interventional approach that could potentially be recommended due to complex nature of evidences.”
In your second comment you say you say that you don’t admit that culture regarding alcohol is the problem and then go on to talk about the cultural problems! And you say ‘excessive alcohol intake’ is the issue, which is my point exactly.
And you say I am confused?! You have contradicted yourself.
As regards your third comment I do not deny alcohol is a fuel to add flames to the fire of hatred or despair in the heart but you wish to deny the heart issues, the essence inside a person.
If you are someone who follows Christ then you will know His teaching.
“Do you still not understand?” Jesus asked. “Do you not yet realize that whatever enters the mouth goes into the stomach and then is eliminated? But the things that come out of the mouth come from the heart, and these things defile a man.
The apostle Paul says in his letter to the Ephesians
“Do not get drunk on wine, which leads to reckless indiscretion. Instead, be filled with the Spirit.”
Again in the Psalms it talks about the Lord making wine ‘that gladdens the heart of man...”
You said “If you were right, we would see more cases of domestic violence broadly speaking and more cases of domestic violence in homes where no alcohol is present.”
Domestic violence takes many forms, not just physical. It might also be emotional or economic for example. Religious abuse occurs and alcohol is often banned in such homes.
I have said my piece, I can say no more to you. I will not reply again.
I didn’t advocate for banning alcohol, you drew that conclusion from me saying that prohibitionistics were correct in correlating alcohol to violence.
It is simply true that most domestic violence is correlated to some kind of drug abuse, most commonly alcohol. Men that wouldn’t ordinarily hit women and children when they are sober, turn into violent monsters after drinking alcohol. Their hearts are not the problem and they often regret their behaviour. Their alcoholism is the problem. You appear to deny this entirely.
If you were right, we would see more cases of domestic violence broadly speaking and more cases of domestic violence in homes where no alcohol is present. But statistically this just isn’t true. For some people alcohol cannot be a substance they can ever consume.
To further my point, the indigenous Australian community in the Northern Territory had an imposed alcohol ban in their communities to help curb issues of domestic violence, child neglect and violent crime. These alcohol bans were recently overturned and we have seen a significant increase in domestic violence, violent crime, child neglect and alcohol related youth violence. So much so the Territory had to employ curfews and call in for additional police resources to manage this issue whilst the community had to effectively lock down their shops and houses out of fear.
Don’t tell me alcohol is a benign substance and somehow changing the hearts of these Indigenous youths is the problem here. They’re committing violent acts because they’re suffering from parental neglect because their fathers and mothers are either dead from alcoholism or are engaging in domestic violence in the home, causing the child to flee and seek refuge in violent gangs. All of this could he resolved by removing alcohol from these communities.
On both sides of my family I have close examples of alcoholism driven domestic violence. My cousin was beaten by her alcohol husband and had to leave him. My uncle beat his wife and neglected his children due to his alcoholism. He’s now sober and regrets his actions but the damage has been done.
The “heart of mankind” is a weak argument in light of the evidence. If the problem were that easy, we would have solved it by now. The truth simply is alcohol is a powerful drug, we don’t need it to live, in fact it’s deleterious to our general health, and it causes social problems. Wholescale prohibition is not the solution but assuming all people can have ready access to alcohol is naive.